How do you know when to give an AMD to a learner versus adapting a tip on a cane? We are diving right into that today with Lynn Gautreaux, who is going to be a presenter at the symposium, and he has so many years experience figuring this out tinkering with it all, and has the expertise to change the way that we look at AMDs and tips, and expand the way that we teach and what we know of as possible right now. So can't wait for you to get into this episode. Let's just hop on in.

In this podcast episode:

• Who is Lynn Gautreaux and how he started in O and M

• Working with Ambutech

• How Lynn came up with his book

• Taking a step forward with Lynn

Transcript of the Episode:

Welcome back to the podcast, my friend. I cannot believe we're in January. I can feel the symposium coming up so soon.

Okay, let me tell you just a little bit about Lynn Gautreaux. And I'm gonna actually give him the floor and let him talk more about himself. One thing that I really like about this conversation that you're about to hear is not only a little bit of the how, of how he made these decisions, and why he decided to pursue this as an expertise, but more in the back-end of who he is as a person. That's really what makes these presentations come to life. And so it's not just that you're listening to somebody just tell you what to do but in listening to this podcast episode, you get to hear the why and learn a little bit about him. So that way, you can take that piece of information and use it in your teaching.

Now, I don't know if I would suggest picking up tightrope walking like he does. But maybe you can make your own decisions after you listen.

Who is Lynn Gautreaux and how he started in O and M

Kassy:
Welcome to the podcast, Lynn. I am so excited that you're here. It's so nice to finally meet you.

Lynn:
Yes, glad to meet you. Talked several times. And I'm glad we actually have an opportunity to do virtual face to face.

Kassy:
I know, it's so cool that we get to be able to connect with people all around the world that we wouldn't have been able to connect with from our own homes and not have to travel or, you know, fight any traffic or anything like that. Well, our audience doesn't really know about you or maybe if they do, then they can get a little refresher. I'd love for you to tell our audience a little bit about you.

Lynn:
Okay, so I guess I started in the field through recreation education. I was in all kinds of sports, but there were… there was sports that were not team sports. So I gravitated towards a degree in recreation education for North Western. And I was in that field. I really liked it.

I happened to come across a person that was the Director of Residential Services at school for the visually impaired in Baton Rouge. And they were having trouble with after school programming.

Back in those days in the 70s. The kids were in school 365 days a year. Only went home for maybe a Thanksgiving break or Christmas break. Other than that the school that actually was their primary residence for you know, for years. And of course, they gradually changed that to kids only went home once every six weeks or so. Then they changed it to once a month and once every other weekend. I believe our school now goes every week.

So anyway, long story short, they asked me if I would come work for them. They were having trouble with that. And so I found it fairly easy to modify all of my background for the visually impaired and blind.

I was the coach of the tandem biking team. We bicycle from San Augustine, Florida to Houston, Texas. I was a gymnast and was in a little community circus and I was catch man on trapeze. I've walked tightrope for 40 years.

In fact, my sons thought every dad had a tight rope in their backyard and so they got a little older and realized their dad was a little different. And I had a tight rope set up but our school taught the kids how to walk tight rope. I was a scuba diver. We had scuba diving at our school for years. I was close with the director. So we had horseback riding for years and years. Did a lot of things, found it easy to modify.

Until I realized as I can to teach the kids these types of activities and how to modify, began to realize that if they can't access the facilities or the organizations or the agencies, then how are they going to take what I teach them and apply it to their personal life after school. So then an opportunity came up for me to go back and get my orientation and mobility certification, which I did, but in between all that I got a master's in therapeutic recreation, which I applied it to school.

But then I had that opportunity and I went to University of Little Rock, Arkansas, got my O and M degree. And when I got it, I realized I love this. So I let all my other certifications go and stuck with O and M. And I've been in the field of vision impairment for 42 years now.

But 17 years ago, Rod Haneline from Leader Dogs for the Blind, called me and asked me if I'd come up there and help them with some Western Michigan practicum students doing cane repair and, you know, restringing, canes and refurbishing and some of the modifications I do. And for some reason, they liked me. And so I've been going up there ever since.

But when I retired, they started using me about 12 to 14 weeks a year. So I'm what's called a contingent orientation mobility specialist. When they need me, they call me and I just got back last month. I go back again in January and in February. So about once a month, you know. One week a month, sometimes more, sometimes less. And so that's kind of my background.

And I happened to get into the area that I'm in because I realized there were issues with some of the things that I observed. During my time, one of those things, for example, were the AMDs. I really thought that kids could do better when they go up steps. Instead of putting the AMD in their left hand and hold on to the rail, they have no frontal protection. So then I realized, okay, I have to do something to modify this.

So I modified it by putting a six inch drop down bore on the AMD at the top. So when they go up steps, they hold on to that load, drop down the board and click on each step just like you would a cane. And I realized that was a generalization skill from the AMD to a cane.

Then I realized that I made a cane for them for school, and then one for them to take home. And then I found out they won't use them at home. And when I asked why they said it was too big and bulky to put in smaller cars. So then I realized, Okay, I gotta do something about that. So I figured out a way to make a folding AMD. So I did a 50 50 fold on an AMD. And Ambutech happened to sit in one of my conferences. And we started talking and working with each other. And then we came up with Ambutech’s folding AMD, which was my original design then. I hope I'm going in the direction you want me to go, Kassy?

Kassy:
Yeah, I'm taking notes.

Working with Ambutech

Lynn:
Okay so then when I was working with smaller kids, my back kind of ache a little bit, because you'd have to bend over to manipulate their hand and make sure they would scan properly. And I realized, okay, that's not going to work. So I developed a tandem bar out of dowel rods using velcro tape.

Well, Ambutech saw that. And now they're tangible or I've worked with them with a design and the tangible was my original design that Ambutech uses. And so then working at Leader Dogs, a lot of the clients there. I don't know if you're familiar with Rochester. Rochester Hills in Michigan. Loads of biking, walking, hiking, running trails, and when I'm up there, they give me a bike because I know I'd get antsy if I didn't have a bike. So I bike the trails, and I love them. They're a really hard pack.

But a lot of the clients I had want to walk on those trails and some trails are a little bit rougher but there's really no tip out there. They have some products, but they don't give me the durability and the flexibility that I was looking for to recommend it to the clients. So then I started a search for modifying the AMD. I didn't want the clients to use an AMD. I wanted them to use a cane.

So then I came up with a design, you know that you saw in the PowerPoint presentation, so that they could have roller mechanisms. I use inline skate wheels, skateboard wheels, five inch deck wheels, but you have to drill them out in the middle and that… let's say I'm telling you all this, but this is 42 years, trial and error work doesn't work chunk in, you know, redo it, refine it. And so the products that I've come up with are fun, really work. And it's kind of a modular design so they can use a cane, maintain frontal protection in a static position. They wouldn't move the cane left and right. And it clears the frontal path with them not having their tips get stuck on roots and rocks and dirt and gravel things like that.

Then I realized that that's a perfect modification for kids in schools that aren't maintaining frontal protection. But you don't want to, you know, an AMD is kind of on the bottom line of what you want to put in a kid's hand, you want them to have a cane, primarily. So then I realized I could take this tip and modify it for my younger students, so that they could use it. The main factor there was, I would go to the school and during recess and see all the canes on the back of the school building. And they're walking around like zombies on the playground, so they won't bump into anything, and when to ask them why they do and that they said, Oh can get stuck in everything, it's aggravating, I'd rather go without it.

So then I realized that modifying the cane to accept an AMD type tip that would give them frontal protection and roll over dirt, grass, things like that would open that area up for them so they could use their cane and still be on the playground. So that's kind of, you know, how I came upon this.

I went to conferences, looking for information, trying to you know, realize there must be people out there doing what I'm interested in. But you know, Kassy, I didn't find anybody. And so I realized, okay, I'm gonna have to do it. So then I started my research. Now, this is just a 1% snippet of everything I went through. But that's kind of the general background. Not only that, I have probably 200-300 sections of folding canes, I can take the tape off of a folding cane, 30 or 40 cane sections at a time and about two hours. And I mean, down to the cane.. It took me months and months and months to figure out how to do that.

And so I've got all these cane sections that I would use. I made a 79 or 80 inch cane, just for fun for Leader Dog until the seven foot six client came there and needed an 80 inch cane. And they called me up and said Lynn, we need another 80 inch cane and I said did that one break, they said no. We have a seven foot six individual that needed that size cane. So you need to make another one.

So I did that just goofing around. And I realized you can take a 60 inch cane and make it a 40 inch cane or 48 inch cane or a 48 inch cane and make it a 60 inch cane just by taking the sections in and out restringing the cane. The new court in tips that Ambutech came up with really was the key to make it a lot easier to do that.

So then I went online and I look for tassel-in covers for blinds. Instead of getting it from Ambuech, I can use an ink cover for blinds that I can order on Amazon, just drill it out a little bit and I can use that as a chord in cover. And so that I can make a cane if you wanted 100 inches tall, I can make it.

So anyway, I did a lot of that goofing around and enjoying it and don't know, all I can tell you is God must have taken this lane and said, okay Lynn, this is your lane, go with it or not. And I went with it. And I love doing this kind of stuff. So that's kind of it in the background.

Kassy:
Wow. And first of all, we are so glad to be able to get to know you and to soak in all of your knowledge because there is so much expertise there. One thing that I love about orientation and mobility is that even though it seems like a really small profession, really, a lot of us have found our own like niche within a niche of an area like you said your cane. And we become the expert in that. Like, I'm definitely not the expert in building AMDs. I turn to people like you and I turned to people like you who've done the research and figured out this work. So that doesn't work.

Before we continue, I want to take a second to really hone in on the difference between a modified AMD cane tip and you kind of touched on it. And as a transition tool versus like the adaptive mobility device in and of itself. Can you quickly define what you mean by those terms, please?

Lynn:
Sure. Now, this might not be in line with what everyone else thinks but that's why I'm glad I live in America and you know, we can, you know, do our own thing.

So the reason I went into this area and what I look at when I look at an AMD. The ideal, of course is put in a cane in an individual's hand. Underneath that of course if they can't maintain frontal protection, you can use AMD. But how do you modify an AMD so you have some generalization skills once they start using a cane. And that's why I did that little six inch drop down you know for stair skills and started using roller mechanisms and things like that.

But then I realized that an AMD is big and bulky. I love the fold and AMD designed that Ambutech or came up with that at the end because that really makes it easy for you to have that kind of an AMD. And it's something that even an adult can use as opposed to an adult using a PVC pipe end because it's made out of the cane material, things like that.

But then I thought, why not come up with something that puts the cane in their hand, but gives them a modified tip so that they can have an AMD type front of coverage when they're moving around in their school, but not the big and bulky AMD, it's a cane just with what I call an AMD tip or modified AMD tip. And that's… you know, so I look at the the tip strictly as something, when an O and M would work with someone that has this kind of a tip, what they would do is just use this little screw on there, you unscrew it, pull their cane out, the own emerald would put the regular tip on their cane and work with them for their cane skills. And then when they get through, they would put the AMD tip back on their cane until such time that the student can maintain fairly consistent frontal protection so that he's not compromised in his or her safety as they move around the school.

But I wanted something easy that the teachers wouldn't mind getting into. So then I realized that the indoor AMD tip uses the typical coupler roller mechanisms that you would put on an AMD. And of course, I modified those a little bit to take the wobble out. I never did like one of those couplers when you move it that kind of wobble a bit. So I wanted to stay that up and make it smooth, which is why I've modified the one inch covers now using one inch sections about a quarter, two and a half inch in thickness and a put on each end of the coupler. And when you put that on the AMD, it smooths that out and doesn't wobble.

So the aim, the tip that the student would use, they have a cane in their hand they use in that tip. But when they go to the playground, I haven't set up so that you can unscrew a little plate on each end and screw in wheels, that would do fine for a playground setting. Because the couplers would not work well in dirt and grass, just like the candy would end up getting stuck. So that's why I came up. So it's kind of a modular design.

So I'll look at an AMD as the typical PVC AMD or the Ambutech folding AMD and that's what most people do. And I took that and took away the whole top part, kept the bottom part and taught myself how to modify it in order to put it on the chip. And I use all local stuff. It's nothing. You have to fabricate nothing. You have to call someone to say I need you to build this for me, then go to the local hardware store and get everything they need to make something like this.

How Lynn came up with his book

And then I realized that I can't go to enough conferences and I'm retired now. I don't have the disposable cash to go to conferences all over the United States and the world. So I did the book with 487 pictures and 150 pages. I did it like a comic book, there's a picture and a narrative underneath it that explains what they're looking at, and gives you step by step, a very sequential pattern on everything I do. Everything that I did in the book is exactly the same thing I primarily do when I was going to conferences, but I couldn't go to enough.

And so I figured, you know, I'm 73. So why not put it down while I still know who I am when I wake up in the morning. So I put it all down to the book. And like I said, used a comic book format with it so that I could let them see it and explain it.

And I'm telling you, Kassy, when my wife went with me to conferences, people would come up to her and say, Oh, I must be so wonderful. Your husband is such a handy-man, and she would laugh and say he can't even scoot two pieces of wood together hardly. And there was a how in the world does it come up with all this stuff. And she said, You gotta go ask him. So then come and ask me. And I would tell him I call it divine spiritual savant ism. Because when I need it, God gives it to me and I go that direction. And, you know, it’s a lot of trial and error on there. I wish I could listen to God better. But there's a lot of trial and error. And some of the things I came up with, I thought I look back in the book and I think how in the world did I come up with that.

So that's kind of, you know, the way I look at an AMD versus this AMD tip that I designed. And like I said, there are some products that might do that. What I find is, I had some students when they would go around with some of these other products and one end the wheel would hit like the edge of a while and it would flex but that tip doesn't flex well and it pops the hook on that was on their cane and you can't use it anymore. And so I realized that I needed something that could flex and not break. You can use my tips to go just about anywhere except you can't go to Mount Everest with the tail. That's a no no but you know for a lot of rougher… 

I had a guy that I worked with. All he wanted from leader dogs all he wanted us to go out of his back door or go about 400-500 yards to his barn to take care of his animals. But he couldn't do it because the tip kept getting stuck. You know, he had grass and gravel and a lot of dirt, typical farm setting. And so this kind of a tip I made for him, and it was perfect. He could take it and roll right up to barn, wouldn't get stuck. And so it kind of the clients kind of were the driving force on me looking, what do I need to do? How do I need to adapt it, and God, I need your help. And that's kind of where I was.

Kassy:
That's amazing. Okay, I actually have a few questions related to what you said. So first, I want to touch on the book, talk a little bit more about that, tell people where they can get it. And then I also want to share, you know, my own experiences with AMD tips, because that's a little bit more of my philosophy as well. And some experiences or at least one experience that I've had. And then you know, all of these stories that lead you to where you are, and that have helped so many other orientation and mobility specialists, I'm just really grateful for all the work that you've done, because at the symposium this year, you're going to be teaching us much more about it, and we're gonna get to go more in depth.

When we have you with the symposium this year, we're going to be with you for an hour and a half. And it's hard to capture, O and M’s attention for an hour and a half. But I feel like I could sit down and learn from you for hours and hours or days and days. Because what you have to share is really fascinating. And I think that a lot of times, we think about AMDs. And we think we know everything already. And what you shared with me has already blown my mind.

So first of all, your book that you mentioned, it's on geauxbility.com G E A U X B I L I T Y. We're going to link that in the show notes. It is called Comprehensive Cane Tip and AMD Modifications, Design and Refurbishing. And this is a self published book that I've seen circulated throughout our Facebook group. So I'm going to go ahead and grab one for myself because it seems to be really relevant for what we need. And a lot of us can say, oh, but we can just buy that at Ambutech and you can buy an AMD at Ambutech, but how you create the modified cane tips is really interesting to me.

When I used to make them, it would be one glued piece together. And yeah, I would have to ask the OT, Can you like somehow screw something in here, and it needs to work like this and I wanted to look like that, and I would have to like wait to get on my OT’s calendar. And I worked at a place where I was in the same building as the OT. Now as contract staff, I often don't know if a learner has OT till we get to the IEP meeting, or until I see it on the visitor sign out sheet because nobody tells me anything. And so I wouldn't even know who to ask.

And a lot of O and Ms are in my same position where we really are just kind of floating out in our own little worlds over here. If you don't have like a handy person in your life, who do you ask.

So the fact that you've made it interchangeable, where learners can use a regular cane tip with their O and M and then use the other one during the regular school day, or have a different one for the playground because the playground is the stickiest part of elementary school for our kids. But it's really hard to get around and to run and play with all of your friends in that situation. So I really appreciate the ability to learn how to make the playground more accessible, because it's definitely a loophole that our kids fall into.

Lynn:
Yeah, the other neat thing about that idea is if the O and M-er really encourages them, and tip the thing, the other sticking point was the teacher. I didn't want the teacher to have to spend 20 minutes trying to figure out how do you take this off? How do you do this? You can take off the little screw in I mean, if I had to go into detail I could speak for hours. But anyway, I use the socket plugs for what other wires go into circuit box.

Now they have plugs that go in there when they're not using, say one of the holes in there, they knock it out, and they screw in this plug. So the way I set this up, they use the AMD with the regular roller mechanisms, the PVC couplers, in the school because it rose really easy and it doesn't tend to drift that much, keeping the cane in the static position.

The other thing is if a student… I always go and look at what the student does when he doesn't think… he or she doesn't think I'm looking at And that is one of the driving forces on where my instructional methodology is going to come from. If I do hand centered, hand centered, and I watch them constantly, and they drift to the right side, well, why don't I just work with them just modify by giving a little bit longer cane, if that's what they're going to do, because adults all the time, I'll give them the option to do hand center and explain to them the pros and cons. But inevitably, probably 70%, say I'm more comfortable with my hand more at my side. And so I just had to modify the cane.

But the good thing about the way I designed this, as opposed to an AMD, usually with an AMD, you have to make a student's specific AMD according to size for several, you might have a dozen AMDs and hoping that you have a student that this one might be okay. With this new AMD tip that I have, he used the same tip, he just used their cane. And so that tip is interchangeable across the board to any student any size, anytime. And if you make two or three of these, that's all you need. You don't need to make an AMD because that tip will takethe place of the AMD and you have that frontal protection.

But I wanted something that the teachers could easily unscrew and screw the wheels. And that's why I call it a modular design. And if the teacher is encouraged and O and M-ers encouraged them then they can use that with the wheels on their playground area, and not have that fear of bumping into one of the swing sets or monkey bars or whatever. And they can feel a little bit more independent out on the playground, instead of walking around, you know, hoping they don’t bump in or hit something.

Taking a step forward with Lynn

Kassy:
Yeah, absolutely. It sounds amazing. I'm 100% sold. I cannot wait to learn more from you at the symposium. We are going to wrap up right now. But I want to give you an opportunity to share, you know, your perspective on something. This entire podcast, our whole premise is that you don't have to be perfect all the time. You don't have to be perfect right now. But in order to be your best O and M self, you really need to just take a step forward, every single day, every chance you get.

Lynne for you, if you could share with somebody, you know who was like, a little bit behind you in their career, someone like me, and I wanted to know how to become a better O and M specialist, what one piece of advice would you give to me?

Lynn:
Always look at the students. And remember, I tell the adults at Leader Dog all the time, I am not in charge of this lesson, you are in charge of the lesson? Why would I teach you something that you're never going to use and that you're not interested in because I'm wasting my time and I'm wasting their time. So always defer to student desires and what the student really wants.

I always look at all the options, I'll make sure that every student when I was in the field had an opportunity to use every different tip that was available, different cane styles that were available, so that they could tell me what do I like. And then I would take what they said like, and then I would incorporate that into the lesson plans for the student. I wanted to make sure they were comfortable.

You know, I'm not a dictator. I don't tell them because I'm not them. But I tell them what all the options are. And then I let them bounce back to me. What do they like and what they don't like, and they can't tell me that unless if I had an opportunity to use all these things, so that they could say by experience, Oh, I like this versus that. And then I can go to that and you know, kind of aim the lessons toward what they really want.

Kassy:
I love that. Thank you so much for sharing. It has been such a pleasure to have you on the podcast today. And to get to see a little bit behind the scenes of who you are as a person and what brought you to where you are, especially with the tight rope you're gonna have to teach me how to tight rope.

Lynn:
Well, I love doing it. Of course, I will add you know, when I retired my wife said Are you finally going to quit walking in tight rope. I headed up one year up to eight feet in the job, my wife crazy every time I'd get on it, but I love being up high on it. But I usually keep it at about two, three to four foot level. I don't go any higher than that. But so I gave it up. You know, when I retired, you know, people didn't have the vision that I had, they thought I was… you know, a little bit out there. And so without having a skill set, they really didn't have a need for the tight rope anymore. And so they took it down, and I got the rope but I didn't set it back up. So I defer to my wife for 52 years and she was happy that I quit walking. 

Kassy:
Oh my goodness. Well, I appreciate you and I cannot wait to learn more for you at this info.

Lynn:
All right. Thank you very much Kassy. I appreciate it.