Welcome back to the podcast. Oh my gosh, I'm so glad that you are here. Today's episode is such a jam. We're going to be chatting with Chelsea who is one of the most amazing orientation and mobility specialists.

In this podcast episode:

• Who is Chelsea Schumaker and how she got into O and M

• Fitness journey that shaped Chelsea

• Benefits of physical movement

• Chelsea’s presentation in the symposium

Transcript of the Episode:

Welcome back to the podcast, my friend! I'm so glad that you're here. Can you believe what time of year it is? I'm in that stage where I'm just ready for 2023. Very excited setting goals! We have so many things coming down the pipe for Allied that I will share with you soon. But I'm really just trying to be the best O and M specialists that I can as well as being a better leader for Allied, you know, our small little internal group as well as the symposium planning committee and for you. And so with that, the thing that I like to do the most is to learn from other people because we don't have all of the answers all within our heads.

And today I get to sit down with Chelsey Schumaker, who is a fantastic orientation and mobility specialist. She received her master's in orientation and mobility and special education from Texas Tech University, and is now going on to get her PhD. Her PhD! Concentrating on O and M. You know, her personal story is really what kicks this whole thing into gear.

When we're thinking about physical movement and why it's so important for our learners to move as much as possible and also gain the understanding of who they are as people, can be people who move around the world in and of themselves, and not have so much learned helplessness. It really, really, really, really sets the tone for why we do what we do, because it's not just you know, their independence or skill, set their goals, but it's also about who they are as people, and what physical movement allows them to do. And I know that we all as O and M specialists have had times where we feel really shackled, working with our team members who just don't get it. And there are ways that we can open up that conversation and become really powerful advocates for our learners. And to do so in a way that doesn't cause conflict, or doesn't cause us to become the bad person, we can find win-win solutions, while working with all of our team members. So without further ado, I want to introduce you to Chelsea.

Who is Chelsea Schumaker and how she got into O and M

Kassy:
Welcome!

Chelsea:
Hello, it's good to talk to you.

Kassy:
It's so nice to talk to you. And especially in this manner. We've been talking a lot behind the scenes, you know, before the recording. And as we've been planning all of this, about everything that's coming down the pipe that we want to share. But first for our community members who don't know you, would you be able to share a little bit about yourself?

Chelsea:
Sure. So I am Chelsea Schumaker. I'm an O and M specialist here in Texas. This is my third years of being an O and M. Professional. I came from the corporate world, which is very different than education, but I absolutely would not change it for the world. So I'm just really happy to be doing what I love.

Kassy:
How did you get into O and M and I didn't even realize that you've only been doing this for three years.

Chelsea:
Yeah. It's crazy. I know. Yeah. So I got into it, actually, because I was so… I was working my corporate sales job. And then I went on a service trip from my sorority, they sent me to the 2018 USABA National Golf ball tournament. I didn't know what golf ball was, I just showed up. I was like, This is gonna be so fun. I don't even know what's going on. This is gonna be great. I'm here to just serve, you know, and I just didn't know that that week was going to change my life. It absolutely rocked my world in a totally different way.

So I made several friends throughout that time. I fell in love with the sport of goalball. It is my favorite sport. I absolutely love it more than anything. And I came home and two weeks later I quit my sales job and applied for the O and M program at Tech and the rest is history.

Kassy:
That's so crazy. Okay, so take me back to that moment when you were watching goalball. Yeah, and involved in the volunteer work. And then when you learned that orientation and mobility existed, can you take me back to that? Or like, what was going on?

Chelsea:
Yeah. Okay, so think about that tournament was it was all adults, right? So there was no children, everybody was 18. Plus, it was really cool to get to sit and talk with the athletes in between games. Because we also our job was like to help make sure they get to, you know, lunch. And, you know, they get to where their courts are, if they ask for help, you know, we were there. So, we made a lot of connections.

And I made friends with this lovely man, his name is Noah, he is still one of my very great friends like to this day, every time he comes to Dallas, me, him my husband. And then last time he was here, our son, we all got together. And so you know, that connection is still pretty strong. But we were talking and so, you know, he's like, asking me questions, right? And he's like, so what do you do? And I tell him, I'm in sales. And… He says to me, he says, you know, forgive me if what I'm about to say, is not socially appropriate. And I was like, oh, no, what is about to come out of this man's mouth? Like, what's he about to tell me? And he said, It sounds like you absolutely hate your job. And I was like, how could you guess?

Because it's true. I did, I hated my job. I hated everything about what I was doing in that moment, career wise, I wasn't feeling happy. And I, you know, the week goes on, right? And this is on like, day one or two, we were there for a whole week. And then, you know, the week goes on and out. We were talking again, and I said, I just really wish I could live within this community forever. Like, I found something that I really am passionate about with goalball. Like, I just don't want it to end. And he was like, how do you think we get around? And I was like, I mean, I know use your cane. And he was like, well duh! Like, he was like, but how do you think we learn that? And he was like, I think you'd be a really good O and M specialist. And I was like, I don't even know what O and M is like, what? And so then he tells me orientation mobility.

And he honestly paid me probably the biggest compliment I've ever gotten in my life. He said, That I smile with my voice. And I didn't quite understand what that meant, in that moment, right. But now that I've been in the field for several years, I've done an internship. Now I kind of get that. And sometimes I try to use that when I'm working with my students like smile with your voice, you know, because this is a scary situation, or this. It's making them anxious, you know, or whatever that situation might be. But yeah, all because my friend told me about O and M, and I looked it up. And that was that. Yeah, I was like, okay, yeah. That sounds like fun. I'll do that instead. And now, I can't believe I spent seven years working in the corporate world. I wasted seven years of my life, like, I wish I would have been doing this from the get go.

Kassy:
But you probably also gained so many things.

Chelsea:
I did.

Fitness journey that shaped Chelsea

Kassy:
We've been talking behind the scenes about your fitness journey, and how the increase in physical movement really impacted your life and how that really related to orientation and mobility and why you are so passionate about this. Would you be able to share a little bit about your personal fitness journey and the increase in physical movement for yourself?

Chelsea:
Yeah, so actually, right before I went to that goal ball tournament, I was talking about what introduced me to O and M. I had weight loss surgery, at the time, I was 400 pounds, so close to it. So it was really hard for me to even try to be physically active, right? Even the bare minimum of things was difficult for me. So you know, I had the weight loss surgery. Before that, I started going to the gym, I started changing what I was eating. And my surgeons and medical team all agreed that just like hitting the reset button on my body wouldn't be really good. So that's why I went ahead and had the surgery.

And I have like, totally changed my life ever since that. I mean, I've lost almost 200 pounds and now I do CrossFit now which is crazy. I'm really into spin. I have to be physically active now. Because my life is very different. It's very dependent on that. Being stagnant doesn't work. For me, even if it's just like getting out going on a walk, you know, it's, it could be the simplest of things. It doesn't have to be an intense like CrossFit workout, you know, but that dedication to physical activity like for myself, it's changed everything. It's changed, like my outlook in life, it's changed my mood and my daily mood. It's changed how I handle stress. And it's for me, CrossFit has kind of become an outlet. And so I'm really passionate about this, especially because it means so much to me, but then seeing our students not being given the opportunity to have that access, because it's easier. So they say, right, it's easier, or they just don't know how to include our students, it's tough, it's tough to sit there and watch, you know.

Kassy:
Yeah, and it sounds like you kind of went through both journeys. At the same time, your life seemed to completely overhaul in multiple areas, and it's all intertwined, you had the surgery, and I'm sure you were getting more physically fit and finding little bits and pieces of that, like, I want to say elation. It's just kind of how I feel when I start working out again, if I haven't for a little while, you feel a little bit happier, a little bit lighter. And you can kind of see the light at the end of the tunnel a little bit more. And at the same time making the decision, the drastic decision to change your entire career around and go from high paying sales to orientation and mobility, completely different cultures, completely different expectations, completely different pay grades. And then you come into this field. And then you see, you know, our students, a lot of times, like you just said, are sitting on the sidelines, because a PE teacher simply doesn't know what to do with them. But they've been sitting on the sidelines of their whole lives most of the time. And they have just so much learned helplessness that they aren't advocating for their own needs, that TVI guys aren't advocating for their needs. So a lot of times it really does come down to the orientation and mobility specialists to say, hey, yes, the student does need to move and or this is how to do it safely. Because that is also an issue as well of like, oh, well, this student has retinal precautions, there's no balls allowed. So they have to sit out when you can work other things in, you just have to be able to have that conversation.

Chelsea:
Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, like I said earlier, it's easier, right, and I'm doing air quotations right now, because it's easier in that moment, to have our students sitting on the sidelines versus, you know, coming up with an activity especially like if the student has a retinal detachment, you know, coming up with an activity to include them in, you know, I had read before holiday break, I had a student that I found out got trampled during PE one day. So you know, there's a lot of things going on in our PE classes that our O and Ms have to be aware of, and start advocating for, you know, so it's definitely a challenging thing, you know. And even our students who are on our active learners, right, who you might not be working with directly, but you're consulting with the VI and the teachers of how to get them involved and just at least reaching, right?

I had a student who, I noticed that he never went outside with the rest of this class, there's wheelchair, and I was like, Well, do you ever take him outside? And the teacher told me no, why would they take him outside because he can't see anyway? Yeah, that one really got me because even that slight change of environment could have done so much for him, you know.

So it's happening in more than just PE but PE, like you said, that, you know, access to physical activity, that being given opportunity. It is a big thing for me, because my whole life did overhaul in a span of like six months, pretty drastically, and it was a whirlwind. And I would not change it. Because now I get to play golf ball with my kids during lesson, you know, because it's fun, and it's very much so works all on O and M skills, and I use it as a scoreboard, like as an ACC lesson for several of my students and it's really fun. They like it. 

Benefits of physical movement

Kassy:
So, yeah. And you touched a little bit on like two avenues. One being the positive effects of physical movement. There have been studies done that show that doing a physical activity, the same physical activity once a week for 12 weeks actually increases self efficacy and self efficacy is just basically a scientific term for self determination, it's slightly different. But it's really the ability to see that you can do things on your own, and then be able to advocate for your own needs eventually, to be the person who can see that I am a person who can run, I am a person who can enjoy being outside, not, I am a person who sits inside during recess, right?

All of those things, those small increases really impact a learner's life. And we know that physical education does wonders for your mental health, and our learners struggle with their mental health. And even if you just look at that capacity, right now, our physical activity, it's going to increase the endorphins is going to decrease depression and anxiety. And it's going to help them to be able to cope with all of the things that they have to deal with in their regular lives, that most mainstream just doesn't have to deal with that level of grief, that level of difficulty to, you know, get to the grocery store, even you know, most of us don't write directly taught how to buy a gallon of milk, and to have that as a rec leisure to be able to come back to it and see yourself as somebody who can physically move and have those experiences, even to draw from is really imperative to them being, you know, successful adults.

Chelsea:
Oh, absolutely. And, you know, it's one of those things where our learners, they have to be given the opportunity for that. And so the best people, right, who could be on their team is Division team, and then everybody that works with them. So, you know, it's important to work on those relationships. And this is something that I've also been working on, you know, with my experience in the field, is, how do I get everybody bought in? Right? How do I get everybody bought into the idea that Suzie here needs to use her cane? How do I get everybody bought into the idea that Johnny can't sit on the sidelines during PE? You know. 

Well, I've been told this at one of my schools, well, she can't do this activity, she can't run, she can't see. And I said, She absolutely can run, and I said she loves to run, it’s just… do you have to do it in a different way? You know, and so, in that instance, I showed them by modeling what running with a tether and running with a guide looked like. And so you know, there's so much more that goes on, when we're not there. But if you get everybody bought in,

Kassy:
So you mentioned, you know, the other team members buying into these ideas, and as orientation and mobility specialist, and really any teacher, we're not taught how to sell, we're not taught how to be of service to somebody in a way that shows them, or that allows them really the window into what we can see. And oftentimes I see two things happen. One, we either avoid the conversation altogether, and then our learners don't get the skills that they need or we come at it in either an aggressive or passive aggressive tone. And neither of those work, and then we wonder, well, why are they listening? Or then we just, like mutter underneath our breaths, or talk with our friends, and gossip about whatever, teacher and old, why am I even gonna try because they're not gonna listen anyway. And it's simply because we haven't been taught sales techniques.

I remember, when I first started, I had my own business, I taught yoga online to moms, I love it. It was adorable, but I had to learn how to sell. And I remember before then I would like send an email out asking for people to do something small because I was in charge of a huge school wide activity. And I would get teachers grumbling at me or like, oh, you sent another email. And then before I ended up leaving my full time job, I did the same kind of situation where I had to send a mass email and I was asking everybody, like 60 people to do more work. And because of the way that I came about it, because the way I approached it, I had over 10 people say thank you. And I was like, what? You didn't think of me when I asked you to do something similar a few years ago, but it was just it's really all in your approach. And I swear my relationships got better when I learned how to get their buy in, in a way that was more of a crucial conversation or like a win-win, you know?

Chelsea:
Absolutely. And if you can, and I say we, as O and M specialists can come in and talk to our PE coaches, or, you know, the staff that are working with our students and really explain what the benefit is, you know, in like an elevator pitch type of way, right? Here's the top three things that the students going to get from being provided access, right. And it doesn't have to be lengthy, it doesn't have to be long, it could be really short, simple to the point of, you know, what the benefit is going to be for the student. Because if they can understand that, hopefully, the buyer will be more from them, and then also to if you have a better relationship with them. Because if you can relate that student's needs back to them as a person, or how long have you been here? What have you been… you know, what's your favorite thing to teach? Or what's your favorite section, and PE? Like, all of that matters, it all matters,

Kassy:
it does. And we're not given the time to build those relationships, we really have to make the time and go out of our way to make that happen. And I find because it’s also myself, a lot of O and M specialists who are introverts, we thrive in O and M. Because nobody talks to us all day anyway, like, I am just fine, just fine being one on one and then walking silently behind them for hours. Like, I don't even people, like who needs a team when you have silence. But that makes it harder for us introverts to reach out and build those relationships. And it's not like so we're just picking on PE teachers.

Chelsea’ presentation in the symposium

But we're… you and I are going to be teaching a webinar on this exact topic on January 11. So everybody who's listening, I hope that you guys would join us, it'll be in the evening time. So bring your favorite beverage, your puppy or kids come sit down and like hang out. And we're really going to be talking about how to get our learners to increase their physical activity within PE because you're not in charge of PE, you're not the PE teacher. So how can you actually make that change in a way that's positive a win, win, and helps your learner so that they're not constantly sitting on the sidelines?

Chelsea:
Yeah, I am so excited about the webinar. Obviously, this topic is really important to me, I wrote my master's comprehensive exam on it. And I plan on covering something similar for my thesis for my dissertation for my doctoral program. So yeah, I'm just super excited, and I can't wait for the webinar, I think it's gonna be awesome. And hopefully, everyone will get a lot out of it.

Kassy:
I really think so too. And one thing that I really look up to Chelsea with is, this was your thesis for your masters, and you're going for your doctorate, and you're bringing this entire piece into your dissertation for your doctorate. But not only that, there's that huge personal side that we've just got to touch on in both areas, you know, you understand the O and M part. And then you also understand the importance of physical activity, because you've lived almost two different lives with your ability to have physical activity. And so there really is no better person to really help to guide this conversation.

And for those of you listening, we really want you to also feel like you're welcome to take the stage with us. So as you come into the webinar, as always, it's not just going to be us speaking at you, we want to facilitate a positive and enriching conversation, which is what the Allied community does so well. And we want to allow you to also be the experts. So as you are signing up and registering for this webinar, once you can do so at alliedindependenceonline.com/training, and I'll give you that information again, at the end, start to think about what actually works for you and what hasn't worked for you, what have you tried, and what successes have you had, so that way you can come armed and prepared to share your expertise with our community. That's really where we grow is not just, you know, the people on the stage. We're not the sages on the stage for just other members of the community who may have a little bit more skin in the game for this one area or have done more research on these different areas or, you know, different aspects about it.

Do you have anything else to say about that Chelsea, what are your thoughts?

Chelsea:
Well, first off, thank you, that was very kind of you. I am really passionate about this topic because it does it. It is something that I have lived personally. And then also to, you know, watching our kids that we work with, it's important that they also have that same ability and the same access to it. So we're just really excited. Everyone come ready to have an open discussion. I think it's going to be great. January 11.

Kassy:
January 11, and it's at 8pm, Eastern Standard Time. We'll be meeting on zoom as always, and you can register for that at alliedindependenceonline.com/training, because I have to think about it. Anyway, it's on our website, and it'll be all over social. So we will see you there. Alright, Chelsea, I want to thank you so much for your time, this has been such a really pleasurable conversation.

Chelsea:
It has been so awesome to connect with you. Always great to talk to you. But it's been good to connect with you in this way. So thanks for having me.

Kassy:
Yeah, you're super welcome. Okay, before we end, Chelsea and I met on Instagram. I know we met in person, we hugged for like forever. And if I know we’re gonna be friends forever.

Chelsea:
It’s like meeting a long lost friend, like seeing them again, like, it was awesome.

Kassy:
That is so great. It's so funny. When I meet people online, most of my friends are online now. It's kind of weird. But then I meet you guys in person. And I could like beeline for you from across the river. That's exactly what we did. It was a huge pockets. We saw each other and we like beeline for one another we were like, Heeeeey!

Chelsea:
Honestly was awesome. Incredible.

Kassy:
But Chelsea is on Instagram and so fun to follow. I love learning about that other side of you because you don't just share O and M you also share fitness and you're really inspirational as somebody who like I'm into fitness for medical and health reasons. It's an absolute necessity for me in my life. And it has been for a really long time. I have anxiety and I've had depression in the past and that is literally prescribed to me that I have to exercise. And so when I see those posts that you make about like your exercise, or… it's just so lovely and inspirational. Would you be willing to share your Instagram handle so if people wanna follow you they can?

Chelsea:
Absolutely, it's @simplyschumie, because my last name is Schumaker. 

Kassy:
Amazing. We'll have that linked up in the show notes for everybody as well. So you can just little early scroll and then click the link. You're off to go looking for it. Thank you so much still the main.

Chelsea:
Of course! Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for having me. It was great.